Share:
POST
TWEET
SHARE
SHARE
EMAIL

How will you vote in an In/Out EU Referendum?

By Chris Dawson February 17, 2016 - 8:51 pm

EU HOmeIt can hardly have escaped your notice that an in/out referendum on Britain’s future in the EU may be just months away, so what are your thoughts on out country’s future?

Deal or No Deal

Currently, whatever deal David Cameron brings back is going to have issues which plays into the hand of the out campaign. Firstly it’ll be said that the deal isn’t be good enough no matter how good it is but the biggest issue is that no deal will be ratified until all EU nations agree on it and crucially that won’t happen until well after the one shot in/out referendum. That plays into the hands of the out campaign as they can legitimately say that we may walk away with nothing at the end of the day.

Migration has played into the hands of both camps, those who want to leave the EU claim that we need to close our borders and stop paying benefits for children that don’t even reside in the UK. Those in favour or remaining in the EU claim (somewhat bizarrely) that everyone camped in Calais will waltz through the tunnel with no border checks and end up camped in the UK shuttle terminals.

One might bear in mind that to board a plane to the UK you need your visa in order before you set out, there’s no reason this couldn’t happen with the channel tunnel. Plus of course migration has become emotional due to the influx to the EU from Syria and whilst of course it matters refugees are very different from economic migrants so the issue has received more publicity than perhaps otherwise justified.

Red Tape for small business

What’s more of interest for us is what happens with business. We’re not in the Euro so that’s not a concern, Sterling stands on it’s own regardless. Staying in the EU allows them to dictate a floor and ceiling for VAT and other financial measures.

What I particularly don’t like about the EU is the constant deluge of red tape which affects just about every online trader out there (especially when other countries often seem to ignore it while we run around like headless chickens trying to comply). Here are just three recent examples which may well have affected your business:

# Cookies

Remember the cookie diktat foisted upon us, you probably still visit website and have the annoyance of a pop up demanding you acknowledge that cookies are required to run the web. Thankfully the cookie crumbled.

# VAT MOSS

Then there was VAT MOSS which was supposed to make our lives easier. There was no VAT threshold so every business no matter how small was burdened with complying and facing investigation by far flung EU member states if they got it wrong. Then one day it was suddenly all change and HMRC decided that even though you were a business as far as income tax etc was concerned they didn’t really want to class you as a business for VAT MOSS as it was simply too much trouble.

# Online Disputes

More recently we hear from the EU that we have to link from our ecommerce operations to ODR and ADR online resolution services. No one of course seems quite clear where you should pop this information on eBay, let alone Amazon where you don’t even have control of the product detail page. It’s just more meaningless red tape to try and get our heads around.

So the EU isn’t that great with keeping red tape down, but then would that disappear if we left the EU? Of course not, sellers outside the EU already have to comply with many EU laws (at least they’re supposed to). It’s worth remembering the recent case of a UK seller raided by the FBI for price fixing. Not residing in the USA didn’t stop his collar getting felt in the UK. Similarly, if we left the EU and still wanted to sell to EU consumers, we’d have to toe the line with their red tape.

Which way will we vote?

Ultimately at the moment the outcome of the referendum looks like a coin toss. There are plenty of arguments for getting out and just as many equally valid arguments for staying in.

Which way are you leaning? Too much red tape and time to get out, or too reliant on fellow EU countries for business and can’t afford not to stay in? Let us know in comments below.

  • Richard
    1 year ago

    Out of the EU for me both on a personal level and business wise.

    • R boyd
      1 year ago

      +1

  • 1 year ago

    I never believed that David Cameron would come back with an agreement that was worth a light and so it seems. Some of his own Conservative M.P.’ obviously agree. One even called what Cameron had obtained as ‘Small Beer’ others seem to think that that is far too generous a description.

    Should we stay in or get out? Well the Euro is a basket case that stumbles from crisis to crisis and the whole effigy of the EU is under terminal strain.

    So if we vote to stay in it is just about possible that the EU will stagger on for a year or two before it collapses in a heap of rubbish on the floor and the various Countries and Governments still in it desperately try to salvage something from the mess.

    Or we can recognise that the EU is in terminal decline and Vote to get out and at least save ourselves. Our Trade is mainly with the rest of the World. We do sell to the EU but they sell a great deal more to us. So we should go back to being a major Trading Nation trading with every Country in the World. GET OUT NOW before it all collapses. I shall be Voting to Get Out and I will be part of the campaign to get out.

  • Martin pope
    1 year ago

    I can see absolutely no benefit in staying in the EU. It is failing as a project, is corrupt, undemocratic, expensive to belong to, has almost no economic growth in comparison to elsewhere. These are just a couple of a host of reasons to leave. I back Britain to make a much better fist of it on her own and will be voting to leave irrespective of what ‘deal’ Cameron returns with. I suggest everyone does the same.

  • Stuart
    1 year ago

    With 20% of our business now in the EU and around 70% of our buying is also done there I don’t want to leave.

    It would be a nightmare and imagine the costs in leaving of changing everything back.

    This just like Scotland wanting to leave the UK, let’s just put the time and effort and money in to focusing on making it better for everyone.

    I hope if we do get this vote and we vote to stay we can then draw a line under it and move on, the Scot’s don’t seem to have done that with rumbles of another go at it…

  • Mike G
    1 year ago

    Leaving the EU now would be the equivalent of Gordon Brown selling the country’s gold at the bottom of the market. Europe has problems, but they’re ones we need to face together. The right-wing dream of a fantasy island free of immigrants and foreign influence is a naive sepia-tinted 50s throwback.

    • Dave
      1 year ago

      What benefit is there to being in the EU? Name me some benefits that you can’t have by having a free trade agreement with the EU?

      Benefits of leaving the EU

      1) You have control of your own migration policy

      2) The return of British fishing waters – that is tens of thousands of jobs being created just like that.

      3) Control of our own agriculture industry

      4) Our seat back on the WTO, the ability to negotiate our own trade deals with non EU countries (which we cannot currently do)

      5) Full democracy returned to the UK, Westminister will create our own laws, so those responsible for creating bad law can be kicked out at election time.

      6) We can protect the NHS from privatisation which is coming with the TTIP agreement being nearly agreed between the EU & US

      7) Foreign criminals can be barred from entering the UK, those who commit criminal offenses in the UK can be deported

      To be honest the list is endless, there are few benefits to staying in the EU and no major ones.

    • 1 year ago

      One benefit is the ease and freedom with which Brits can go and live and work within the EU. It’s a right that I’ve taken advantage of and may again.

      As the million or soBrits in Spain show, it’s two way traffic. And having seen the bother people have getting work visas etc in the States, I wouldn’t want those barriers in Europe.

      Dan

    • Peter King
      1 year ago

      the idea that if the UK left the EU the massive amounts of UK citizens in spain/EU would have to leave is ridiculous.

      As is the idea that the EU citizens in the UK would be deported.

      The only effect of brexit would be on future laws/agreements, it would have no effect on the status quo, there’s too much to lose on both sides.

    • Peter King
      1 year ago

      1) You have control of your own migration policy

      The UK has full control over irs migration policy.

      2) The return of British fishing waters – that is tens of thousands of jobs being created just like that.

      The UK has full control over fishing rights, the fact that the fishing fleet is shite is not Europe’s fault.

      3) Control of our own agriculture industry

      The UK has full control over agriculture industry, the fact that the industry is unsustainable without European subsidies is not Europe’s fault.

      4) Our seat back on the WTO, the ability to negotiate our own trade deals with non EU countries (which we cannot currently do)

      Of course we can

      5) Full democracy returned to the UK, Westminister will create our own laws, so those responsible for creating bad law can be kicked out at election time.

      No parliament is going to limit its powers, in Europe or not.

      6) We can protect the NHS from privatisation which is coming with the TTIP agreement being nearly agreed between the EU & US

      The NHS is a Ponzi scheme, it will be privatised whether we are in Europe or not,

      7) Foreign criminals can be barred from entering the UK, those who commit criminal offenses in the UK can be deported

      Already the case.

  • Richard
    1 year ago

    I’d definitely vote to leave for both business and personal. I see it making very little difference to my business. We buy and sell into Europe but I can’t see that changing. There’s too much trade for both sides to lose so they’ll find a solution. If anything, we might eventually be able to set up better deals with other countries or grow more in the English speaking commonwealth countries.

    Personally, I want to leave so our politicians can’t use the EU as an excuse for inaction. Our elected politicians shouldn’t have their hands tied by rules decided by unelected commissioners.

  • asd
    1 year ago

    Do you people realize how many goods are imported from EU :)? Add import taxes to your breads, yogurts, electronics, etc… Good luck.

    • ardvark
      1 year ago

      I was previously pro EU until I did a lot of background reading. What I found is that the argument about trade being lost if the UK leaves is a total lie. The truth is the UK can be in EFTA or have bilateral agreements to avoid painful import/export rules and duties not to mention the most obvious overlooked point that the Lisbon treaty contains a clause that a member state leaving the EU has the right to continue its trade on the same terms. Its really about whether you want to pay 55 million a day (32 million after the so-called rebate) for politicians who are virtually useless and paid huge amounts to impose huge amounts of regulations on us. The squabbling in recent years has become too much to bear not to mention expanding too quickly, the euro etc etc. Its a mess, and it was not much fun before. Its time to leave, its going nowhere other than downhill. You cannot align fanatical socialist backwaters with the reality of trying to run an economy in a global market. No way should the uk remain.

    • Richard
      1 year ago

      There will still be free trade between the UK and the EU if we leave. There is absolutely no way that the big European countries will want import / exports tariffs to one of their biggest markets. It isn’t in the interests of Britain or the EU.
      Think how many Citroen, Peugeot, Renault, VW, Audi, BMW, Mercedes, Skoda, SEAT, Volvo etc are sold in the UK. That’s just the motor trade.
      It’s in the EU’s interest to keep free trade. It’s scaremongering to suggest they wouldn’t.

  • Martin
    1 year ago

    We have to stay in. To leave would be the most foolish thing we have done as a nation for centuries.

    We risk isolating ourselves and taking away any influence we have in the world. I can just see it 10 years down the line, the EU, NAFTA, China carving up the trade agreements, and dear old UK will be an irrelevance.

    The EU represents both our biggest trading market and our biggest source of inward investment to the UK. There is huge potential for trade growth in Eastern Europe. To trade with the EU we will still have to make major payments (countries like Norway and Switzerland already do) and we will still have to comply with the EU requirements if we want to trade there. There will be no appreciable change in the red tape we must follow.

    What Cameron is negotiating is a sop for political purposes. It is of no relevance. We need to be part of the EU no matter what. Leaving would make no difference to the refugee crisis and could make it worse for us, EU immigrants are about 2.4 million versus 2.2 million Brits working in the EU, so not far off equal – and we would expect the Brits to be treated the same as any other person in the countries where they are working. Only 2.2% of workers from the EU claim benefits in the UK, compared with far far higher rates for we Brits ourselves, they are a net contributor in tax so a financial benefit to us, and who exactly would do the jobs they do? The majority are young working age, and we have an ageing population that needs both workers and tax payers. We need doctors, nurses, teachers, all kinds of other healthcare staff, agricultural workers etc to name just a few, we have falling unemployment down to 1.6% and over 600K job vacancies unfilled. Actually we need these people in the UK.

    As with any organisation of course there are things that don’t always work in our favour, but the benefits and the strategic necessity make these of minimal importance.

    • Kyle
      1 year ago

      Addressing your three paragraphs:

      1) I think you’re failing to see the forest for the trees. In the globalised world the rules are increasingly coming from the UN, WTO, etc. The EU is a middleman from the 60s that is becoming increasingly irrelevant. Once the whole world is one giant free trade area governed by the UN/WTO/G20/etc then what’s the point in being in the EU?

      2) Most of the payments Norway, Switzerland, etc make to the EU are voluntary development aid. They see it the same as you and pump money into developing Eastern Europe and things like the E roads in the hopes that they can then sell more there. The mandatory payments they make are mostly membership fees to EEA, EFTA, EUCU, etc but since most people don’t really know what the EU is they get all these organisations mixed up.

      3) Immigration has little to do with the EU. The freedom of movement is a requirement of the single market – not the EU. Most plans to leave the EU actually have the UK remaining in the single market via EEA or similar so there would be no change to immigration. Of course UKIP doesn’t like that which is why they’ve been mostly shut out of the leave campaigns.

    • Sam O'levski
      1 year ago

      I get really worried when I see or hear statements like these….

      a) and we would expect the Brits to be treated the same as any other person in the countries where they are working.
      b) Only 2.2% of workers from the EU claim benefits in the UK, compared with far far higher rates for we Brits ourselves
      c) they are a net contributor in tax so a financial benefit to us, and who exactly would do the jobs they do?
      d) The majority are young working age, and we have an ageing population that needs both workers and tax payers. We need doctors, nurses, teachers, all kinds of other healthcare staff, agricultural workers etc to name just a few, we have falling unemployment down to 1.6% and over 600K job vacancies unfilled.
      e) Actually we need these people in the UK.

      In response –
      a) I worked in Spain legally and the Spanish get better more preferential treatment, so all is not equal abroad
      b) of course a far higher percentage of Brits claim – it’s our country, never mind many should be forced to work and are too lazy to do so
      c) financial benefit my *** – ask in any post office how many foreigners are sending their earned money ‘back home’ – many of them spend as little as possible here in order to support family elsewhere, a fact I can see around me every week where I live thank you
      as for who would do the jobs they do….how about some of our own unemployed who I see daily propping up pub doorways and carrying bags of food bank groceries so they can spend dole money on more booze/drugs
      d) office for national statistics Jan 2016 states 5.1% unemployment (1.6% ??) and 1.68 million people available to work, so more than enough to fill 600,000 vacancies, even if many would need retrained
      e) actually we don’t – how can it be sensible to pay unemployment benefits to a lazy Brit, and have a foreign worker supporting them with taxes but also sending money overseas ?
      If our own able bodied people were forced to work, they’d be healthier and cost the nhs less money as a result, and their earnings would perhaps circulate around the uk economy rather than the Romanian, Hungarian etc economies.

    • derek duval
      1 year ago

      You hit the nail on the head….out for me

  • Alan
    1 year ago

    Out for me – but I expect a solid “stay” result, so a non event.

    • Ardvark
      1 year ago

      Yes, I think there is too much money being pocketed shutting down uk based factories to move them to Hungary etc. and other backhanders for the UK elite to be allowed to leave by the political class. The UK economy has shifted from a global focus to the dishwater economics of the EU. Look at the rate of growth of S & P 500 companies compared to EU/UK ones to see why the UK should leave. The US will continue to dominate and the EU and UK will continue to limp along while despotic regimes increasingly dominate the global economy.

      That aside there are too many powerful people with money sources related to the EU so the propaganda will continue and one way or another the UK will remain, like it or not.

  • Steve C
    1 year ago

    Out. Its a dinosaur from the 70’s and corrupt as you like. All this bull about loss of jobs and security is the same rubbish they pedalled out back then. I was there and voted no.Trouble is that some people seem to believe this nonsense. Cameron could not give a dam he will be off to do another Blair and earn a fortune.

  • Bryn
    1 year ago

    In

    Purely because Amazon Germany is 40% of our business and a very profitable part.

    Yes new agreements would be made I am 100% sure but how long would they take and what administrative changes would there be? The end result the same but potentially a bucket load of hassle and possibly reduced sales in the interim.

    If it wasn’t for that I would probably edge towards leaving

Recent Comments

6 hours ago
northumbrian: asal cliste penantic...
7 hours ago
PGC: I used to live and breath ebay as a non business seller. Buy stuff, use it,...
9 hours ago
Andy Cornwall: If you sell on marketplaces you need 24/7 cover, Amazon has expected you to reply...
9 hours ago
timo: YOU'RE clearly an English speaker, so getting it wrong 3 times in one short post...
9 hours ago
nobody: So, from a victim's point of view, posteo.de is even worse than the ransom-ware crackers,...