5 questions regarding Scottish independence and ecommerce

By Dan Wilson April 28, 2014 - 12:46 am

I shall start by disclosing my position: I don’t want Scotland to break away from the United Kingdom. I don’t believe that an independent Scotland is economically viable and anyway, England, Wales and Scotland are better together. The cultural, geographical and historical bonds make us a unit that I want to see persist.

But beside any sentimentality, there are some serious questions to ask and practical issues to address. Here are just a few that spring to mind with regards to ecommerce:

What currency will we be trading in?
Here’s the big question. Will Scotland use Sterling if she becomes independent? Will Scotland be forced to use the Euro in the long run by the EU? Or will it use a new currency? Who knows? Massive uncertainty but maybe not an insurmountable ecommerce problem in time. But a different currency to England will surely make cross-border trading less attractive.

How will it affect couriers and postage?
I wonder what will happen to Royal Mail, for starters. The Universal Service is brilliant for remote areas in Scotland. One rate applies to all, whether you’re in Shepperton or Shetland.

And it will be a boon for the couriers. Many already have surcharges for the more distant parts of Scotland. Independence will be just the excuse they need to up rates and find greater profits for all shipments made to Scotland. Shipping stuff to Ireland is, after all, already more expensive.

What platforms will we be using?
Amazon quite cunningly have one marketplace for the UK and Ireland and seemlessly present that to buyers. eBay have two sites and will be reluctant to provide a third for eBay Scotland. Calls for it will be inevitable though. And what will happen to domain names?

Will there be duties and tariffs?
England and Scotland’s divorce might not be amicable. And in the brave new world of an independent Scotland, that may well be outside of the EU, there’s no certainty that the free movement of goods will persist as a principle. Both English and Scottish governments may be free to practice protectionism on cross-border trades. Not good news.

Will Scottish sellers be shut out?
It might all be just too complex for the big marketplaces. Too much hassle to bring Scottish sellers into eBay and Amazon with all the complications that might entail. And Scotland will be a small country. It might not be worth the investment to ensure that just five million Scots are served. Money might be better spent on 9 million Londoners. eBay or Amazon London would be a more profitable venture than anything tapered to Scots.

What do you reckon?

  • 4 years ago

    Sounds like scare mongering a bit, none of these things sound insurmountable.
    Many companies have stated It won’t effect theIr trading with Scotland..
    Why would It… Money money, money honey.. Makes
    the world go round.. Trade will continue.. Any gaps will be plugged, by business..


    • JD
      4 years ago

      That’s ok then, just 6 million odd lucky people who will be forced to pay more for their stuff!

    • 4 years ago

      Not scaremongering. There is definitely something about my line of work which rewards being provocative.

  • northumbrian
    4 years ago

    were English and live in Scotland and what we say is HELP! the Scots are lemmings leaping off the cliff

    • 4 years ago

      Hopefully sense will prevail in the end.

    • JD
      4 years ago

      You are obviously concerned that the ‘sense’ that will prevail will be that of Alex Salmond!

  • Stuart
    4 years ago

    It has to be a no and while we are on the subject how much money is all this messing about costing the ‘UK’ tax payer.

    I don’t even believe in having a Scottish, Welsh or NI government even if they are not independent, how much money does all of that waste!!!!

    I read an article once that explained how much it cost in just logo design for all this different public bodies that have to have four different versions and the money involved was scary I can tell you.

    If they vote yes it will be years of chaos trying to sort all this out and cost even more money.

    • 4 years ago

      Can I point to what happened in Cornwall a few years ago. Cornwall used to have a County Council and 5 District Councils. Then it was decided that we should have a Unitary Authority. So all the various Councils were amalgamated into a New Unitary Cornwall Council.

      As Stuart says it was and still is chaos although after years of mucking around it is much clearer. However there are still problems caused by the amalgamation.

      But every organisation had to have a New Name and a New Logo and in the previous Councils there was a lot of organisations. Just as an example each District Council had its own Housing Department and they all had their own names and logos and computer systems many of which were not compatable and of course hundreds. possibly thousands of vehicles each which had to be redecorated with the New Names and Logos. Then there was the stationary. All the Pre-Amalgamation headed notepaper etc went into the bin to be replaced by New Headed Notepaper. The waste must have been enormous.

      All of the various Departments were re-organised. Many people left their jobs either to re-locate within the New Organisation or to move to jobs outside of Cornwall. And of course nobody seemed to know anything about what had happened only a short time before under the previous Councils.

      If this happened in Cornwall and we were not even thinking about Independence just imagine the chaos and waste that is likely to happen in Scotland. Also I was told that there are many in Shetland and Orkney who view Rule from Edinburgh as being almost as bad as Rule from London and remember in this regard Shetland and Orkney for many centuries were in fact a part of Norway. I seem to remember that they only became a part of Scotland as part of a Marriage Settlement.

      In case anybody thinks that I am a Yes or a No. Quite frankly I do not really care except that I believe in Democracy and that during an Election the Truth comes out and I am convinced that in the current campaigning there is very little Truth coming out. I have a horrible feeling that 2 or 3 years down the line from the Referendum the whole lot will fall apart like a house of cards.

  • Angry Scot
    4 years ago

    Nice to see the usual uniformed nonsense.

    Scotland contributes more to the exchequer than it receives in spending allocation and has done for each of the last 33 years.

    As an independent nation Scotland would have a higher GDP per capita than the UK currently does.

    If you want to look at trade balance specifically then it’s worth noting that Scotland is a net exporter of goods and contributes a disproportionately large percentage of the UK’s overall export total.

    In terms of public services the vast majority of Scotland’s services, including Police, Fire, Justice, Education and Health are already separate and consistently outperform their English and Welsh counterparts.

    Whether or not you ‘believe’ that the case for Scottish Independence is economically viable or not is irrelevant, it’s not a subjective matter and I doubt you have any facts or economic credentials to substantiate your belief.

    I understood the role of this site to be in discussing e-commerce (primarily marketplace) tips, tricks and news. It really doesn’t look good to stick your oar in about a matter in which you aren’t adding any constructive information merely for sensationalist value.

    Ultimately this is a matter of political self determination for the people of Scotland.

    • Confused Brit
      4 years ago

      So you’re saying this will not affect e-commerce whatsoever?

    • northumbrian
      4 years ago

      so when the Russian bear bombers fly into Scottish air space whos airforce will let them know there being watched.?

    • 4 years ago

      I wonder if your statements in regards to Scotlands economic status hold true if you exclude the Oil Revenues. After all I understand that the oil revenues have long since peaked and are steadily declining. So will Scotland be as financially strong as you seem to believe in the future without the massive boost to its economy from oil>

      In addition the Scottish Nationalists have made it very clear that the UK Nuclear Deterent will be evicted as will a lot of other parts of the UK Defence Forces and obviously this will also hit significantly the Ship Building and Ship Maintenance sector of the Scottish Economy. After all if the Nuclear Submarines are transfered to Plymouth it will be a massive boost to Plymouth, Devon and Cornwall. The South Wests benefit will be Scotlands Loss.

      So how do your statements about Scotland stand up when these and other factors are taken into account.

    • Stuart
      4 years ago

      It will effect ecommerce as it will effect the whole country if it goes ahead.

      Yes we might not know the total in’s and out’s of the Scottish economy but what I can tell you is Scotland will be paying shed loads more as a country on it’s own that it does now so it WILL effect it’s economy.

  • Alain
    4 years ago

    “I don’t believe that an independent Scotland is economically viable and anyway” Could you try to be more condescending?

    “Money might be better spent on 9 million Londoners.” Boris Johnson has been quoted saying much the same thing.

    • 4 years ago

      That second quote is taken out of context. My point was regarding corporate spending not government spending. But I will clarify.

      If I was an eBay manager, looking at the expense of developing a eBay Scotland marketplace, it would be a no brainer to me not to spend resources on it when an eBay London site would be far more profitable.

      Business realities.

    • Historian
      4 years ago

      “” “I don’t believe that an independent Scotland is economically viable and anyway” Could you try to be more condescending? “”

      Perhaps he’s referring to history. The Act of Union was precipitated by Scotland bankrupting itself and throwing its hand in with England.

  • A Welsh Brit
    4 years ago

    The economic case has not been proven by any means, and I truly hope Scotland stays in the UK.

    Shipping prices to Scotland are bound to increase, plus a small increase to transaction fees.

    If Scotland became independent I also think its a simple fact that a lot of saddened and some angry Brits would ‘vote’ with their wallet, and spend their dosh with rUk sellers, a lot of people like to buy British.

    I think it will generally work in the favour of rUK on-line retailers, but lets hope its doesn’t happen.

    • 4 years ago

      It seems to me inevitable that carriage costs to and from Scotland would increase. And that would be detrimental to the competitiveness of scots sellers.

    • jimbo
      4 years ago

      And English sellers. Would £3.20 be the minimum cost for sending a small item to Scotland via Royal Mail?

  • davelovesbay
    4 years ago

    I think they should go if they get voted, it was due right before the last recession and and then the topic got closed down because they needed loads of free money from the capital.

    If this means cheaper royal mail rates for the UK, id be quite happy for them to leave as deliveries to highlights via courier are only hassle anyway. We fill them because we feel obligated not because of profit and more often than not end up subsidizing them.

    It seems apparent Scotland wont keep the sterling, they will have there own fluctuating currency, and if you are believe the scots independence arguments this strength would only mean their exports will become overpriced and noncompetitive in an international market.

    Bad news for whiskey and other exporters im afraid.

    • 4 years ago

      One area that will affect almost all of us will be in regard to Postal Charges. I still send out all my Books via Royal Mail. If Royal Mail stops at the England/Scotland Border will it be like the post to Southern Ireland before they joined the EU. Before the Irish joined the EU the postal rates were virtually the same as domestic UK. Then Southern Ireland joined the EU and it was treated as Europe and the rates went up dramatically.
      If Scotland is Independant and still in the EU(not certain it will be allowed to stay in the EU). Will postal rates to Scotland become Europe Rates?

      I was told that post to Southern Ireland goes to Belfast and then is sent by truck to Southern Ireland. So what is it that justifies the increase in Postal Rates to European?

    • 4 years ago

      On the point of the Scottish Whisky Trade(I note that it was spelt whiskey – surely that is Irish Whiskey and Scotch is Whisky)

      The buyers of Scotch Whisky are on the whole buying a quality product and the cost of such as postage or shipping is probably a small proportion of the final landed price. So Whisky probably will not suffer too much. However all those products where postage or shipping is a much larger proportion of the final landed price could be in serious trouble.

      In addition if Scotland was not able to join or stay in the EU could cause serious complications. Even worse if they were not able to keep the £ sterling or join the Euro and had instead to invent their own currency even if tied in some way to either the £ sterling or Euro.

      So a Scottish Dollar(for sake of arguement) but tied to the £ sterling would still be vulnerable to currency fluctuations that could put the Scottish economy under threat. Then what would happen in some future Banking Collapse. The UK Government bailed out Scottish Banks last time around because Scotland was part of the UK.

      However if Scotland has left the UK and has an invented currency all of its own and a Scotland Based Bank was to fail would the Scottish State bail it out because there is no need for the UK Government to bail it out. I wouild point to Iceland and the massive problems that Country faced when its Banks failed.

      Could be interesting. As I said previously in 2 or 3 years after the Scots have left the UK there must be a possibility that the whole house of cards could come tumbling down.

    • davelovesebay
      4 years ago

      Im sure a 30-40% upside in the scottish dollar would affect everyone and we saw it GBP vs USD no so long ago. Those types of swings are not abnormal.

      The Scottish independents state, that Scotland will be a power house and have much much higher living standards as a result of being free from the UK. I think similar to sweden was it they said (where a pint of beer costs £7-8) (And the ladies are far more attractive so you need to drink less)

  • Craig
    4 years ago

    We are a Scottish trading company and in no way want independence. There really is no need for it. As mentioned we have the ability to send products to Wales, Shetland and even the Channel Islands under one service. It would not only cut off Scotland. It would most likely cut of some other countries who import many of Scotland’s exports. Its not broke. Don’t fix it. BETTERTOGETHER

  • James
    4 years ago

    Dan, i would thank you to check facts before dipping into politics. the quote “I don’t believe that an independent Scotland is economically viable” is an insult. a poorly informed insult.

    anyone with access to the facts can see clearly see that scotland is not only economically viable, but can flourish. how many nations do best when what they need/want is ignored in favour of their neighbours interests?

    please dont jump on the bandwagon of ‘uncertainty’ either. unless you can predict the future after a no vote? will the UK be in europe after the referendum on european independence? will the UK be forced into the euro in 5 – 10 years? how will UKIP do at the next general election and how will that affect things? unless you can answer with absolute certainty, dont be fool enough to point at others who cant predict the future either.

    to address your (mainly sensationalist) qustions:

    what currency will scotland use?
    does it matter to you? if someone purchases on their euros are converted to pounds automatically, you get paid in pounds, why do you care how they paid? you dont.
    (if you can accurately predict future currency fluctuation then please feel free to debate them at length, if you can’t please avoid spreading uncertainty hysteria, as previously requested)

    How will it affect couriers and postage?
    probably not at all. we want to be free, we havent gone insane. nobody is proposing armed border guards and passport checks, there will be no cross border tarriffs. the first courier to raise the price of shipping to scotland after independence will see all their scottish custom move to the next courier. it may even improve things for us here (at the moment i can send an item 400 miles south, for less than it costs to send it 40 miles north). nobody knows how RM will change when their universal service requirement expires (scotland may actually buy back our RM/SM? our MSP’s voted 90% against the sale)

    what platforms will be using?
    it really couldnt matter less. i dont care if they make an that’s an identical mirror of , or if its top to tail in tartans and haggis, or if we keep using
    it’ll be the same products either way. the seller will be paid exactly the same. it will make zero difference to you south of the border and about as much difference to me (i may take three seconds to update my bookmarks)

    will there be duties and tarriffs?
    massively unlikely, possible, but massively unlikely. like i said, we havent gone insane, we’re not looking to close borders. if there are, they wont be prohibitive. try asking who would actually do that and to what end? does scotland want to choke itself off from the world? is TheNationFormerlyKnownAsTheUK really that bitter? if they are do they want the international community to see it? No.

    Will scottish sellers be shut out?
    did you actually type the sentence “It might not be worth the investment to ensure that just five million Scots are served. Money might be better spent on 9 million Londoners.” with a straight face? as an experienced ecommerce specialist, adult, owner of functioning brain, or participant in capitalist society, please tell me again “a market of 5million you’re already succesful in should just be pulled out of for no valid reason” and expect to be treated with credibility.

    One of your statements sums up perfectly why I’m voting for independence (among a million other reasons)

    “If I was an eBay manager, looking at the expense of developing a eBay Scotland marketplace, it would be a no brainer to me not to spend resources on it when an eBay London site would be far more profitable.”
    -Just replace eBay manager with Westminster Politician in that sentence, that’s basically where we’re at right now. Business Realities.

    Scotlands future should be in Scotlands hands, anywhere else is the wrong place for it. if we make mistakes they’ll be ours to make. if we do things right it’ll be in our interests, not our neighbours.

    • 4 years ago

      Thinking about your assertion that “Scotlands Future should be in Scotlands Hands’ I am old enough to remember the dismantling of the British Empire. Across Africa Colony after Colony were calling for Independence and calling for the Right to Self Determination.

      Many of those Countries have suffered from Civil Wars, Invasions, Corrupt Politicians and Civil Servants etc. Indeed now many of them have long forgotten being a Colony of Britain and are Economic Colonies of China. Now I am not saying that Scotland will go the same way but Independence is not completely in your own hands.

      So what could happen. You challenge such as myself and Dan to come up with the future from our Crystal Ball. As you know none of us has access to a foolproof Crystal Ball…Not even those like yourselves that view Independence as being all goodness and light.

      The thing is that we all know what the future basically holds if Scotland and England remain in the Union. Its if they split that we do not know. I have said previously that during the Election Campaign the truth should be coming out and I do not believe that it is.

      So if the result of the Referendum is to split Scotland from England I still suspect that after the Vote nobody will really know what is going to happen. So on Referendum Day +1 or even +51 or even +365 I doubt if anybody in Scotland will really know what is going to happen.

      The trouble is that if the Vote is for Independence and the split has happened there will be no going back. England, Wales and Northern Ireland will be changing everything that needs changing to exclude Scotland and in Scotland all the various systems will be being changed to operate just in Scotland. If the Scottish Voters have made a terrible mistake or more likely the Scottish Politicians cock it up I am very sorry Scotland and the Scottish will be stuck with it.

      If the Scottish economy goes bust or a Scottish Bank goes bust I’m sorry its nothing to do with London or the rest of the UK. Its Scotlands own problem and you will have to sort it out yourself.

      I’m not saying that this will be impossible but it will be far more difficult without the strength of the rest of the UK to help. And don’t expect that the EU will be that interested to help. Indeed it is very likely that Scotland will not be allowed to remain in the EU. After all several EU Countries have problem regions. If Scotland splits from the UK and then is allowed either to remain in the EU or is allowed to go through some fast track Joining Procedure the other EU Countries with problem regions may very well be afraid that their problem regions could be allowed the same.

      So while I believe that the Scottish Voters should consider everything that is put in front of them. I am concerned that more is being hidden that published at present…from both sides. In which case the Scottish Voters could go into the Referendum not really knowing the reality of what faces them. So after the Referendum they could have a very nasty shock but by then it could be far too late…There will be no going back.

    • davelovesebay
      4 years ago

      RBS has said it will move all its main staff and HQ facilities out of Scotland if it goes independent.

      Pretty much says it all really.

    • 4 years ago

      RBS has a problem. The EU Banking Rules specify that a Banks HQ must be in the Country where most of its customers live. As Scotland and England and indeed Wales and Northern Ireland are considered by the EU to be all the same Country it does not matter that RBS has its HQ in Scotland.

      However if the Referendum caused Scotland and England to split then RBS cannot have its HQ in Scotland because the majority of its customers are in England a different Country.

      So RBS and several other financial institutions are considering their options. Obviously one is to move its HQ to England. But there are others.

  • James
    4 years ago

    and now we’re being compared to African colonies? without so much as a hint of irony. oh dear. you really do think that much of us.

    I would thank you to go away and look up a list of what Scotland has given the world. compare it to one of the colonies you compare us to.

    your typical condescending view of us is just one more thing we would gladly wash our hands of, even if it does end up costing me a couple of quid.

    moving on. …

    the original post is nothing but scaremongering, it was Dan challenging Scotland to peer into a crystal ball, not I. I asked the same of you and one could not be provided. so can we all drop the “uncertainty” nonsense once and for all.

    we can agree answers are not being provided. im not surprised. the answers are mainly held by the current powers, and it’s absolutely in their best interest to hide anything that shows how Scotland would be better off.

    the British media has set about a campaign of lies and misinformation.( for example, the mail printed on the same day “UK pensions crisis” in England, and “pensions safer in UK” in Scotland) I’m disgusted that tamebay are jumping on the bandwagon in this sensationalist manner.

    if you have something to contribute to the truth then please do, if you’re merely spreading sensationalist political propaganda then please cease to do so. uncertainty hysteria is not welcome.

    I do know what continuing in the union means for me, it means my nation being overlooked in the interests of the South East. it means my country not getting the government it votes for at every election. it means my sporting heroes being stolen as British when they win and thrown back as Scottish when they lose….

    I’m happy to debate the politics of it all day long, this is not the place for it, so if you can stick to ecommerce and fact I’ll endeavour to do the same.

    • 4 years ago

      I’m sorry that you don’t like the comparison with the African States getting their Independence. There are relatively few parts of established Countries that have split away from the original. A few examples are When the Soviet Union fell apart after the collapse of the Iron Curtain and of course when the Confederate States of America broke away from the USA and of course that caused the American Civil War.

      It is true that Scotland has contributed much to the World. But I am not convinced that after Independence Scotland will be able to contribute so much that it can be as prosperous as you have claimed previously.

      Let us think about the Campaign so far. During a General Election the various Political Parties publish their Manifesto and all including the Press will question them. The strengths and weaknesses of their arguments are debated and hopefully the Electorate can see the truth of the various Political Parties positions.

      In the Referendum Campaign I get the impression that little real Fact is coming out from either side. I know that there are still months to go. Possibly enough time for the real facts to come out. But I am not convinced that any real truth has started to come out. I get the impression that neither side really wants it to come out. In which case the debate will be sub standard and the result could be driven more by sentiment than fact.

      I am afraid that the result could be the wrong one for Scotland. By this I mean that it would not be the result that would have resulted had the electorate really known the facts. Because of this in a year or two the whole house of cards will fall apart. In which case just who do you think is going to want to pick up the pieces?

      So lets think about the worst situation. Scotland has failed spectacularly. Alex Salmond and the Nationalists have all disappeared. But Scotland and the Scottish people are stuck in a bankrupt country. They cannot disappear. They have to sort out the mess that has been left behind.

      Their new leaders approach the London Government to try and reinstate the Union. But the London Government has found that since Scottish Independence England Wales and Northern Ireland have sorted out all the problems that pandering to Scotlands continuous demands have caused. Living Standards in the three remaining countries have improved significantly and the calculations of how much it will cost the three remaining countries to bail out Scotland are astronomical and will cripple their economy for years. So after much debate they make it very clear that Scotland wanted independence so now it has to live with it.

    • northumbrian
      4 years ago

      tScotland needs to consider s that once divorce is finalised
      the rest of the UK are unlikely to request a remarriage

    • 4 years ago

      Statute books already written
      There’s no option for reversal of independence. Ever.
      Orkney, Shetland Isles and Outer Hebrides can vote to be independent of Scotland.They can opt to stay in the union.
      The scenario’s are great debating material, but common sense will prevail & Scotland will remain in the Union.
      By the way, my wife calls Scotland Antarctica. Everybody knows where it is, but nobody wants to go there!

    • northumbrian
      4 years ago

      yeah lets debate the politics , without scottish labour MPs
      there will never be another Labour Prime minister from Scotland like Gordon brown
      or a Scottish Labour chairman of the Treasury select committee
      both of which left us in a right plight

    • 4 years ago

      Lets remember Gordon Brown as Chancellor. He was the bright individual who taxed out of existence the Work Place Pensions that provided so many Working Men with a secure Pension in their old age.

      Can you imagine a Tory Chancellor being so stupid.

      So No Labour Government in London EVER again would be a very attractive result for England, Wales and Northern Ireland.

  • 4 years ago

    One thing we have learnt, is that should the Scottish nationalists gain their much wanted independence. It won’t be because they are full of mirth….

    • James
      4 years ago

      no, we’ll win it through petty childish retorts. 😉

    • davelovesbay
      4 years ago

      Dont wait for the vote, kick Scotland out then invade them and make them our slaves. Whilst also putting the whole cost of the war in their heads and indebt them for generations.

      Makes more sense to me.

      They may take our iron-bru but they’ll never take our ‎Alex Salmond

  • 4 years ago

    I wish England, Wales and N. Ireland also had a vote to decide the outcome of the United Kingdom.
    As an Englishman, I am incensed that English laws are decided by Welsh, Irish And Scottish MP’s, whereas we have no say in their parliamentary affairs.
    Why is it that I cannot write my nationality as English on hotel registration forms (I have to be British) whereas Scots, Irish And Welsh can use their national identities?
    The discussion regarding Scottish Independence will continue until Susan Boyle sings, but I’m certain there will not be an Independent Scotland.
    For Scotland to remain in the EU, all 28 member countries must agree to their membership. Spain will not, as they do not want the Catalans to become independent, and giving Scotland the nod would only give Catalans more reason to fight for independence from Spain.
    An independent Scotland would go the same way as Rhodesia. Scottish translation of Zimbabwe is Ochaythenooland. Can’t wait to see if Alec Salmond grows a ‘tache like Mugabe’s!
    You can call me cynical. I resemble that remark.

    • 4 years ago

      Its not only that English Laws are voted on by MP’s from Scotland, Wales etc. Scotland has only one Tory M.P. and a lot of Labour MP’s. So at a General Election we can, and do, have the situation that England would have a Tory Government based upon its own votes but when Scotland, and Wales are included with their Labour MP’s we end up with a Labour Government.

      Now before anybody thinks that I am a Tory I am not, and of course coming from Cornwall where Tory MP’s are also not popular I am not a Tory Supporter. However I am a Democrat. It has always seemed sensible to me that once we had a Scottish and Welsh and Northern Ireland Parliaments that we should have an English Parliament and indeed in regard to Cornwall that we should have a local Cornish Parliament. In our case with a Unitary Council it would be relatively easy to convert that Unitary Council into a Cornish Parliament.

      With the current Westminster Parliament down graded to a UK Federal Parliament with perhaps 150 MP’s. The bulk of Local decisions being decided on locally. As an example why is is that to get a Pedestrian Crossing on a busy road the decision has to go all the way up to London? Why can’t the decision be made in Truro?

      In regard to National Laws why should something that affects London and the South East have to rely on the votes of Scottish MP’s.?

      Its all right for Scots to talk about the problems that they face with dealing with London but why should decisions that have nothing to do with Scotland have to wait for support from Scottish MP’s?

      When the Scottish and Welsh Parliaments were set up why did we not see a substantial reduction in the numbers of MP’s(at the Westminster Parliament) being elected in those Countries?

  • Andy
    4 years ago

    Postage costs and currency are relatively minor considerations although there is little doubt Royal Mail in Scotland will become independent and will therefore either have to increases prices or attract significant subsidies from a newly independent Scottish state.

    Scotland is the least densely populated country in Northern Europe and has the most remotely dispersed population so it’s pretty certain there will be a significant increase in postage costs without the huge global service subsidy Scotland currently attracts from Royal Mail.

    But this will apply to all public services. But these are minor issues in comparison to the Spanish blocking an independent Scotland joining the eu due the fears over the basque separatists and mass migration of the financial service sector to the city of London in the event of independence.

    Everywhere you look the numbers and issues don’t stack up but there are plenty that want to ignore the facts. Personally I hope they leave the union there is little doubt medium to long term the rest of the uk will be better off financially.

  • JD
    4 years ago

    ‘Scotland is the least densely populated country in Northern Europe …. ‘

    If you ignore certain countries including (but not limited to):

    Sweden, Finland, Norway, Iceland, Russia (includes non-European areas) ……

  • boardsurfer
    4 years ago

    If Scotland gains independence it is not going to sink into the sea, sorry its just not.

    It is just as unlikely to bankrupt, I have yet to see any evidence for this claim.

    Will it have problems? of course it will and anyone who thinks otherwise is deluding themselves, they will have all the problems of a newly independent country and knowing Scotlands luck a few more beside .

    All that said the problems will be Scotlands problems and I am sure they can all be sorted out.

    The vote? it will be close , head over heart and history always is, I would prefer a landslide one way or the other and have an end to it.

    oh and yes I am Scottish, live in England but I am proud of Scotland and all its faults.

    • northumbrian
      4 years ago

      thats the real point,

      your Scottish and living in England ,were English and living in Scotland

      its called Great Britain no one is really independent of the other

    • john
      4 years ago

      @northumbrian Always thought you were in Newcastle….lol …don’t know why lol

    • northumbrian
      4 years ago

      newcastle is tyne and wear it gained independence from Northumberland it uses stottie cakes as currency

  • john
    4 years ago

    We are in Scotland on the border. England is 10 mins away. Make no difference if I post in England or in Scotland. Will make no difference to sales or revenue for us.

    I am a NO voter, however the better together campaign do my head in.

    Scotland can use whatever currency they want that’s fact, how much control they have over that currency is another matter.

    I don’t understand why we are better together, What’s in it for England?. (Scottish Parliament is supposedly a burden on the british economy)
    I think the YES vote is too early. Scotlands economy needs to stronger and more sustainable.

    • 4 years ago

      Cornwall is predominately a Tourist Area. When I was doing the Traction Engine Rallies with my Sales Stand it was a very rare event when I did not see at least one Scottish Banknote.

      It is a historic fact that certain Scottish Banks have the right to print their own Banknotes. Going on holiday some Scottish people would take some in their wallets. I know that I would often be asked “Do you take Scottish Banknotes”. It was usually because some other stalls had refused them. In my case I would take anything that was legal. South Sea Shell Money, Gold Dubblooms anything including Scottish Banknotes. But others looked at them and seemed to wonder if they were legal.

      If the Scots vote for independence they will need their own currency and my guess is that it will not be as easy as some give the impression to get others to accept it. Then there is what to call it and what value to put on it and if to tie it to some other currency such as the US Dollar, £ sterling or Euro. Or to let it float to find its own value.

      It is not as simple as some seem to think. As the currency could have a large part to play in the success or failure of Scottish Independence it has to be right. If it is not it could drag the whole independence down. And just to make it doubly important you only have one shot at it. So to scream that the Scots are going to carry on using the £ sterling is not going to be the answer. It has to be a well thought out plan and from where I am sitting such a plan just does not exist.

      Now heres a question. Go back to before the US Revolt against the Crown. Back to the mid to late 18th century. What was the currency of America?….I will tell you it was whatever currency the Pirates and others had siezed. Spanish, Portugeuse, French etc. All were pressed into use. Each was given a value and the Americans used it. So if you were shopping in Boston in about 1760 you could be carrying all sorts of coins in your pockets

      Also we are all familiar with the US Dollar symbol. What does it mean…Its actually a representation of the Straits of Gibraltar because so much of the early American Currency had been siezed from the Spanish the Americans adopted a Spanish Symbol.

      In fact at times even the English have used coins siezed from such as the Spanish or made from Gold or Silver from the same source. The history of currency is a fascinating one. But today it is far too important to be left to Pirates to supply the coinage. In fact in Britain we have even had occasions when the currency has become so debased that the Government has called it all in and melted it down and issued a completely new coinage.

      Now I am not saying that the Scots will be using coinage siezed by Pirates but it is vitally important that the plans are all in force and well thought out because if they are not it could be a disaster.

    • davelovesebay
      4 years ago

      Vote Alex salmond in i say and lets see where Scotland is in 5 years under his leadership.

      Would he have delivered what he promised ?

      I think is worth ago, just to watch watch his epic cock ups and constant blaming of England.

      I cant give nurses in scotland a 10% pay rise because Henry the 8th invaded in 1860 and left a horrible mess, blah blah blah

      Its the Englishes fault, they want to destroy us.

      Same arguments as immigration, blame them for everything

    • 4 years ago

      I think that davelovesebay is right in thinking that the Scots will continue to blame everything on the English after independence. I have worked in Offices. Somebody leaves and for years every error, cock up or whatever is automatically their fault. Even things that dated from long after they left its always Freds fault or Mary did that.

      So the Scots will be blaming the English for the collapse of their currency; the oil wells drying up; the haggis stud farms going down with the haggis plague; everything will be the fault of the English.

      After all its a lot easier than admitting the Alex Salmond and the Nationalists couldn’t run a booze up in a Brewery.

    • northumbrian
      4 years ago

      in our village every year they have a street football game that tradition says the-football is considered to be an Englishman’s head , and every year all the locals jump on a horse to ride about the country side in an anti english festival with its historic roots in protecting the area from the English

      it seems in Scotland anti racist laws dont apply to the English

    • 4 years ago

      A few years ago I had a book in stock about the Scottish Marcher Lords. These and the equivalent on the English side of the border for centuries were in almost continuous Warfare. They were raiding across the border. Burning and raping and siezing the cattle. Didn’t I read that Carlisle has changed from being in England to being in Scotland fairly regularly over the years.

      No doubt your local festivals are a continuation of these Marcher Wars.

  • davelovesbay
    4 years ago

    Now that Alex Salmond has raised this issue, it wont go away. Every few years there will be some kind of fuss about scotland going independent. Because its been allowed to go on. In the end scotland will leave regardless. Because its just easier to blame England for its problems.

    GO i say, Walk out the door, Dont turn around now, your not welcome anymore.

    When i ask Scotland, ‘Just what is it you want to do !’

    The answer is

    ‘I mean yeahhhh, We wanna be free, Free to do what we wanna do, and we wanna ride, we wanna be free to ride our machines with out being hassled by the MAN…

    And we wanna get loaded, YEAAAAH

    and we wanna have a good time……

    and thats what Scotlands gonna do ….. were gonna have a good time ! …. Were gonna have a party !’


    • northumbrian
      4 years ago

      yep there will be no magic wand waved on independance day, the poor will still be poor! Scotland will still be wet, cold, and in the north
      only more so

    • john
      4 years ago

      Don’t eat the orange smarties!!!!

    • northumbrian
      4 years ago

      Beware of the three legged haggis

  • davelovesbay
    4 years ago

    let Scotland go. I dont want my tax money wasted on 5 million popl when theres 6 million in london alone.

    They may have some oil, but pay back the companies that invested in it, In haggis and whiskey and be gone with you !

    • 4 years ago

      davelovesebay does not want his tax money wasted on 5 million in Scotland when theres 6 million in London where his Tax Money can be wasted.

      May I put another point of view. I do not want 1p of my Tax Money to be wasted anywhere. I want responsible Government that always gets good value for every pound of Tax Money. That of course will mean No HS2 which with a (current) price tag of some £50 Billion and little or no benefit to anybody is going to be a massive Financial Black Hole for many years to come. And just to please everybody in this discussion after HS2 there will be HS3 and possibly HS4 and where is the ultimate destination of all these HS’s….Scotland.

  • davelovesebay
    4 years ago

    I meant to say waste millions every few years on compaigns to pursuade 5 millon scots to stay in england. When 6 million alone in london!

    Let the scots.

    Build a major airport
    Build a major finacial hub
    Build a nuclear defense and deterant
    Build a national army, that is repsected globaly
    Build a major shipping port
    Build up a reputation as an important global country
    Build up relations independantly of England with key strategic global partners.
    Build a currency that known through out the world and once the global trading currency
    Build a capital globally respected and important as london
    Send troops around the world to maintain global stability and aid in disaster relief

    If Alex salmond can do all these things and 100s more from North sea oil.

    I’d like to see him try.

    • boardsurfer
      4 years ago

      Crikey! Thats quite a list.

      Did one person in England do all of that?

    • Davelovesebay
      4 years ago

      Actually its a small list, in relation to forming a globally respected country over a several centuries and generations. So no, one person did not do that, but one person was in charge most of the time.

    • 4 years ago

      Which one person because as these were all done over several centuries and generations and a human life span is still near enough three score years and ten apart from such as Highlander(Duncan MacCloud) off the TV I cannot think of anybody who has survived anything like that long!!!

  • davelovesebay
    4 years ago

    Yeah it was Duncan MacCloud, he was in charge all the time. Rather than ‘one person’ being in charge most of the time.

    • 4 years ago

      Thinking about Duncan MacCloud(Highlander). That programme is on the Horror Channel along with Wonder woman and Doctor Who. I can only think that the Horror does not refer to Horror as in Blood and Gore(although every edition of Highlander usually has somebody getting their head cut off. Instead it is a reflection of the quality of the acting and scripts.

      But can you imagine an Immortal running the economy or even ecommerce? Duncan MacCloud for Chancellor or even Prime Minister. Now that really would be interesting.

  • 4 years ago

    I’m English and take a very different view on independence for Scotland. I’m a democrat and, beyond that, consider my political leanings to be irrelevant. This isn’t a matter that greatly concerns me at all. If the majority of Scots wish to go it alone then so be it. No need to get uptight about it, the sun will still rise in the morning either side of the border.

    Scotland can quite easily exist as an indepedent nation whether or not they are granted EU membership. To do this they will have to live within their means and organise budgets accordingly. Many small nations do it and there’s no reason why Scotland can’t even when the oil runs dry.

    On defence a small nation is simply wasting money funding a bloated defence force as they can never hope to match China, Russia or the US (or the UK even). They may see it as sensible to fund fishery protection vessels, maritime aircraft to keep a watch on oil and gas fields and maintain a small army for ceremonial use (tourism income) and/or the UN funded peacekeeping business (as Fiji does).

    You don’t need to look at the post war decolonisation of the empire or even the disgracefully corrupt regimes of modern day Africa to find comparisons. It’s not that long since we had a fairly messy divorce with most of Ireland. Today Eire is an independent nation and, would you believe it, the lights still work there. When their banks and economy went round the U bend due to the constraints of the single currency their ex (The UK) was quick to offer a huge loan over and above the bail out by the EU and IMF. Why? Because, apart from being a good neighbour, it was in our interests to make sure Irish businesses could pay outstanding bills to British suppliers and continue buying from us.

    Now Ireland doesn’t maintain much of an army and they don’t have the kind of oil industry Scotland would have for some years yet. But they have some great brands and they do well with bloodstock, agriculture and their tourism industry could be a model to any country. Scotland can do equally well.

    People complain that there is a lack of real facts in this debate and tend to point the fingers at the nationists as if they should have all the answers. Why? And how can they have many of these answers to hand when nobody will negotiate a deal with them until they’re independent?

    So best of luck to the Scots. If they choose independence I’m sure eBay will buy the domain from Scotland’s own internet registry and you will still see a well known supermarket in most Scottish towns just as you do in Ireland. I’ve absolutely no doubt a free trade agreement between the UK and Scotland will be in place within no time if EU membership is refused. Remember Norway isn’t in the EU but has all the benefits of membership (and doesn’t use the Euro). So you don;t have to join the EU if you’re willing to adopt EU ways.

    Those wanting independence aren’t so stupid that they don’t realise they will have to make their own choices on what benefits their nation can pay to the young, the elderly and the vulnerable. They know they will have to decide how much they can afford to plough in to public services and, no doubt, realise all too well that some issues like retirement age & pensions, dental/health charges, tuition costs, highways, railways might or might not be given as high a priority in an independent Scotland compared to the UK. They will have to cut their cloth to fit.

    It’s likely there would be times when Scotland seems to struggle compared to the UK. There would also be times when Scotland seems to boom. Eire was booming before the Euro bubble burst, that’s the way it happens. It’s highly unlikely the Scots will risk everything again trying to ship wigs to Panama and set up a colony so I doubt we would have to ever consider letting Scotland rejoin the Union.

    As a divorced man I can tell you it pays great dividends long term to accept reality, not view this as rejection, and leave the Scots to determine their own future without attempting to influence anyone with scare stories disguised as questions or opinions claimed as facts.

    All that said, if I was running a business in Scotland that sells beyond the Scottish border I would vote “No” in the forthcoming referendum for obvious, selfish reasons but I can well understand why many other Scots are attracted to independence. Let the majority view prevail and best of luck to them whatever the outcome. One thing I can say with certainty is their football team will still be crap.

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